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Post by fbi on Dec 19, 2014 20:24:30 GMT
In the last two weeks, I have come across several people who seem to be confused about the rules regarding this. It seems (recently) to be a common misconception, that following a foul break, if your opponent, goes in off with his break, then you have two visits. This is not the case, unless your opponent also foul breaks! I really don't understand why people all of a sudden, do not understand this.
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rusty
County Player
Meanmachine. CSC M
Posts: 429
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Post by rusty on Dec 20, 2014 20:35:43 GMT
If it is a fair break and the white goes in . This is a non standard foul 1 vist only .
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Post by kezhills on Dec 20, 2014 23:02:40 GMT
So if I'm playing either of you Russel's.
You break only 3 balls hit or white off the table.. That's my break 2 shots to me.
If I then break and put the White in, my understanding is that's only 1 visit to you is that what your saying and I'm correct in thinking?
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Post by fbi on Dec 21, 2014 0:00:54 GMT
So if I'm playing either of you Russel's. You break only 3 balls hit or white off the table.. That's my break 2 shots to me. If I then break and put the White in, my understanding is that's only 1 visit to you is that what your saying and I'm correct in thinking? Not quite sure what white off the table has to do with it Kerry, as you can perform a fair break whilst sending the white flying. The key is, if you have two visits following your opponent's foul break and you then go in off on your break, your opponent only gets one visit. |
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Post by kezhills on Dec 21, 2014 1:42:46 GMT
So if I'm playing either of you Russel's. You break only 3 balls hit or white off the table.. That's my break 2 shots to me. If I then break and put the White in, my understanding is that's only 1 visit to you is that what your saying and I'm correct in thinking? Not quite sure what white off the table has to do with it Kerry, as you can perform a fair break whilst sending the white flying. The key is, if you have two visits following your opponent's foul break and you then go in off on your break, your opponent only gets one visit. White off the table was an example of foul break? Seen it done, miss the pack skying the White off the table |
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rusty
County Player
Meanmachine. CSC M
Posts: 429
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Post by rusty on Dec 21, 2014 16:50:37 GMT
Trust you kerry to make things complicated . As i said if it is a fair break 4 balls hitting a cushion or a colored ball ( Not the black or White ) being potted and the white drops down a pocket this is a non standard foul one visit and open table . If it is not a fair break then it is a re-rack and the oncoming player has two visits
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Post by fbi on Dec 21, 2014 20:43:50 GMT
I see your confusion Kerry. Launching the white is a foul, punishable by your opponent being awarded two visits. It is not, however a foul break!.
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Post by monkey on Dec 22, 2014 6:34:39 GMT
There are changes to the World Rules coming into force for 2015. Would players rather stick with the rules we have until the end of the season or change at the new year?
I have not yet gone through the two rule sets word for word to exactly analyse the changes but I can see that there are no longer serious fouls. Those fouls are reclassified as standard fouls or loss of frame fouls as far as I can see. I will go through them tonight and email all captains. We do have laminated sets of rules for every venue that have been provided by Dale. You can see both sets on the EPA website.
Any thoughts?
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Post by MalteseMauler on Dec 22, 2014 8:39:05 GMT
it might be easier to incorporate the new rules for the new season as opposed to now but i dont mind either way its up to the majority
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Post by dmiley on Dec 22, 2014 15:46:48 GMT
Is X7 not quite significant?
"In the absence of any competition / tournament rules to the contrary, two referees will referee
each frame. One referee will make the standard calls such as "Second Visit" and “Player A on Red
(or Yellow) Balls" while the other referee will keep the time.
Both referees’ will be involved in the refereeing of the frame and either can call fouls.
If one referee calls a foul, the other referee cannot overrule the call. That is, the two referees
have equal authority."
To my eye, that seems to be the only other change.
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Post by P.A.U.L on Dec 23, 2014 8:01:11 GMT
Is X7 not quite significant? "In the absence of any competition / tournament rules to the contrary, two referees will referee each frame. One referee will make the standard calls such as "Second Visit" and “Player A on Red (or Yellow) Balls" while the other referee will keep the time. Both referees’ will be involved in the refereeing of the frame and either can call fouls. If one referee calls a foul, the other referee cannot overrule the call. That is, the two referees have equal authority." To my eye, that seems to be the only other change. That's not new. Try the highlight version www.epa.org.uk/images/rules/World%20Rules%202015.pdfM7 - being my personal favourite - can think of lots of players falling foul of that, or maybe I'm just kidding!! |
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Post by monkey on Dec 23, 2014 10:24:18 GMT
Yes, M7 could be applied in lots of situations. However, I believe it was previously a serious foul and similarly could be applied to lots of situations.
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Post by dmiley on Dec 23, 2014 15:32:54 GMT
P.A.U.L, I understand that it, in particular, is not highlighted, although the title "Referee's Guidelines and Duties" is- even though no section of the rule set is- which suggests something has changed. Having worked through the 2014 World Rules and Guidance for Referees, I can't really see any evidence of its previous existence, and '18.3 Duties and positioning of the timekeeper' in www.epa.org.uk/wrulguid.php seems to actively suggest that it isn't the case. Or, at least, that's what it seems to look like to me. If it is in there, please can you direct me to it, just for my own peace of mind? The fact that, as you say, it isn't highlighted means it should/must be in there somewhere, and it's just that I can't see it. I like to think I'm pretty up with the rules, and knowing any errors on my part would be helpful to my knowledge of the game. Cheers! |
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Post by P.A.U.L on Dec 24, 2014 8:59:19 GMT
P.A.U.L, I understand that it, in particular, is not highlighted, although the title "Referee's Guidelines and Duties" is- even though no section of the rule set is- which suggests something has changed. Having worked through the 2014 World Rules and Guidance for Referees, I can't really see any evidence of its previous existence, and '18.3 Duties and positioning of the timekeeper' in www.epa.org.uk/wrulguid.php seems to actively suggest that it isn't the case. Or, at least, that's what it seems to look like to me. If it is in there, please can you direct me to it, just for my own peace of mind? The fact that, as you say, it isn't highlighted means it should/must be in there somewhere, and it's just that I can't see it. I like to think I'm pretty up with the rules, and knowing any errors on my part would be helpful to my knowledge of the game. Cheers! Its there In dodgy colour and font, if you print out the complete rule set its a lot easier to read. |
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